Mass Immigration - Show Me The Benefits

SteveYork said:
I'm not familiar with Munzenberg (I'm sorry, (((Munzenburg))) as one of the names associated with the Frankfurt School. This looks like a list of things that someone thinks are happening, and thinks are bad, collated and stamped with a label of their choice, rather than being a statement of anyone's doctrine.

I may regret this, but can you share the source you looted it from?
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I should probably of not included any names, poor selection on my part.

As you know I am not big on political theory, mostly I go on my own judgement of what I see going on around me and form my views on that. I think you are probably correct in that this is the view of a commentator of sorts. probably with his own agenda but it's content resonates strongly with me.

By that definition I am going on 'anecdotal' evidence, but given the 'reputable' main stream media is not in any way reliable I simply do the best that I can.
 
AFCDorset said:
I should probably of not included any names, poor selection on my part.

As you know I am not big on political theory, mostly I go on my own judgement of what I see going on around me and form my views on that. I think you are probably correct in that this is the view of a commentator of sorts. probably with his own agenda but it's content resonates strongly with me.

By that definition I am going on 'anecdotal' evidence, but given the 'reputable' main stream media is not in any way reliable I simply do the best that I can.
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The previous post was most interesting
 
Club_B00k_Crutchless said:
Not sure of the relevance of your questions.



Who put you in charge?


Yeah, let's go back to the good old days when men were men and women knew their place. Never mind anyone straying from "normal", throw them in an institution for the rest of their lives.
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I think that you are confusing me with one of 'your lot', a Stalinist maybe.

For me, 'normal' is people getting on with their own lives and not foistering their absurd ideas on others. It is your life, get on with it, just don't expect validation from me, and of course do not expect me to pay for it.

As for your other point, today Mrs AFC and I had a lovely pub lunch, it was an order at the bar job so I did the necessary fetching and carrying. Mrs AFC is not required to fetch her own drinks from the bar, neither is she expected to pay.
 
AFCDorset said:
Morning Steve.

I have looted this from elsewhere. I will just add that this kind of operation against the western capitalist countries may well go by different names but since the failure of old school political/economic marxism, it is the weapon of choice and, quite frankly it is working.

1. The creation of racism offenses.

2. Continual change to create confusion.

3. The teaching of sex and homosexuality to children.

4. The undermining of schools’ and teachers’ authority.

5. Huge immigration to destroy identity.

6. The promotion of excessive drinking.

7. Emptying of churches.

8. An unreliable legal system with bias against victims of crime.

9. Dependency on the state or state benefits.

10. Control and dumbing down of media.

11. Encouraging the breakdown of the family.

• abolish differences in the education of boys and girls.

• abolish all forms of male dominance – hence the presence of women in the armed forces.

• declare women to be an ‘oppressed class’ and men as ‘oppressors’.

(((Munzenberg))) summed up the Frankfurt School’s long-term operation thus:

‘We will make the West so corrupt that it stinks’.”
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This 11 point plan was not a Frankfurt School creation. It was something invented by Timothy Matthews.

Having fled Nazi Germany, some of the Frankfurt School members saw consumerism in the United States as another, subtle, hidden form of fascism.

Mass distraction, whether it be through music, the media, films, sex, drink, drugs creates manufactured consent. Make people too comfortable, or distracted to revolt against oppression.

The School came to recognise that on both sides of the political spectrum, there are totalitarian tendencies. The real true danger is single-minded ideology. We see that in many things that are wrong with the world today.
 
sixthswan said:
This 11 point plan was not a Frankfurt School creation. It was something invented by Timothy Matthews.

Having fled Nazi Germany, some of the Frankfurt School members saw consumerism in the United States as another, subtle, hidden form of fascism.

Mass distraction, whether it be through music, the media, films, sex, drink, drugs creates manufactured consent. Make people too comfortable, or distracted to revolt against oppression.

The School came to recognise that on both sides of the political spectrum, there are totalitarian tendencies. The real true danger is single-minded ideology. We see that in many things that are wrong with the world today.
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I do not believe that this was an 'invention' as such, more an analysis, a distillation of the aims of hardline totalitarian organisations such as the Frankfurt School and the US deep state.

I saw the plan and simply drew the comparison with what is occurring in the real world, there is not one of the 11 points that has not been happening, in this country (among others), for many years.

There is most certainly in my mind a serious totalitarian threat to our way of life, whether you want to call it communism, fascism, corporatism or anything else is simply not important. It is an amorphous ideology dedicated to the subjugation of most of mankind to an unaccountable totalitarian state that we will have to rely on for everything.

To me this is quite obvious from what I see happening in the world, I know you believe that this has always been the case to an extent, but in the last 2-3 decades it has become obvious.
 
It was much more obvious in the past, when you think of very obvious candidates.

In many ways, the people have allowed some of those 11 things to happen, without any co-ordination from the State, Deep State, or the 0.1% who run the world.

Take number 7 for example. Our Head of State is the Head of the Church.
But people have turned their back on church attendance by choice. Not through encouragement, or compulsion.
That doesn't mean they aren't religious, or don't hold values relating to Christian values. As you have stated yourself in the past.
The fact is that the Church is part of the Establishment and a source of much indoctrination, control, abuse and heartache.
It's a good thing that church attendance has lowered.

What are Christian values anyway? Which God are we talking about?
The God of love and peace; or the one of wrath and vengeance?
 
sixthswan said:
It was much more obvious in the past, when you think of very obvious candidates.

In many ways, the people have allowed some of those 11 things to happen, without any co-ordination from the State, Deep State, or the 0.1% who run the world.

Take number 7 for example. Our Head of State is the Head of the Church.
But people have turned their back on church attendance by choice. Not through encouragement, or compulsion.
That doesn't mean they aren't religious, or don't hold values relating to Christian values. As you have stated yourself in the past.
The fact is that the Church is part of the Establishment and a source of much indoctrination, control, abuse and heartache.
It's a good thing that church attendance has lowered.

What are Christian values anyway? Which God are we talking about?
The God of love and peace; or the one of wrath and vengeance?
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That is where we differ, I think. The 'obvious candidates' are, well obvious but I believe that it is happening in a very controlled way. The brutal methods of control are no longer much used, in this country at least, it is more subtle, driven by propaganda, financial and social pressures, selective education and the effective 'banning' of dissent or any normal political discourse.

In the case of the Church I believe that the established Church in the UK is being deliberately undermined in a number of ways, often by it's own actions. Fundamental principles are being worn down and it is being turned into another vacuous socio political organisation.
 
AFCDorset said:
That is where we differ, I think. The 'obvious candidates' are, well obvious but I believe that it is happening in a very controlled way. The brutal methods of control are no longer much used, in this country at least, it is more subtle, driven by propaganda, financial and social pressures, selective education and the effective 'banning' of dissent or any normal political discourse.

In the case of the Church I believe that the established Church in the UK is being deliberately undermined in a number of ways, often by it's own actions. Fundamental principles are being worn down and it is being turned into another vacuous socio political organisation.
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No we don't differ. I was just suggesting that sometimes people (sadly) don't need any external direction at all.

The established church has always been part of the brutal and subtle control of the people.

If you're a Christian, or hold Christian values - you must follow the teachings of Christ. Who vouched for worship in communities, not churches. For Him a "church" was a body of believers, not a building. Certainly not an organisation with deep links to politics and power. Not forgetting of course that he was looking to reform Judaism, rather than create Christianity.

The Church of England is an anomaly, only created so that Henry VIII could get a new shag. As opposed to the English Church.
 
sixthswan said:
No we don't differ. I was just suggesting that sometimes people (sadly) don't need any external direction at all.

The established church has always been part of the brutal and subtle control of the people.

If you're a Christian, or hold Christian values - you must follow the teachings of Christ. Who vouched for worship in communities, not churches. For Him a "church" was a body of believers, not a building. Certainly not an organisation with deep links to politics and power. Not forgetting of course that he was looking to reform Judaism, rather than create Christianity.

The Church of England is an anomaly, only created so that Henry VIII could get a new shag. As opposed to the English Church.
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This is a difficult subject for me, very contradictory. Most of my life has been lived in accordance with 'christian' values, this from someone who has no religious belief whatsoever. I love the sense of community that surrounds some churches (in the conventional meaning) and the sense of decency, honesty, charity that can be generated irrespective of the 'flavour' of that church.

I am interested in history, not so much the detail, the big sweeps of history that model the world and much of that comes through religious writing but then I have no interest in theology or 'religious' writing in general. Architecture too, I find many places of worship particularly the great European Cathedrals awe inspiring, others places almost frightening.

That said, the sense of peace that I found in the modest church of St Mary's in Harrow has never left me.
 
sixthswan said:
Lines Written Beneath an Elm in the Churchyard of Harrow - Byron
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It is a fabulous spot. A thousand years of history, right there. Some times you can feel the weight of it.

Sitting in the church yard in a snow shower, Christmas 2010. Magical.
 
Organised religion has a lot to answer for, but I feel that same about St Nicholas and St Mary de Castro in Leicester.

Neither are particularly peaceful, but with the weight of history - they are magical.

The former has structural parts from as early as at least 880AD, but there have been suggestions that part of the fabric of the structure dates from Roman times. There is a reused Roman brick on the west wall, which bears the footprint of a dog - which must have walked on it nearly 2,000 years ago. Roman columns in the grounds. The remains of the Roman baths next door.

The latter is the connected deeply with Chaucer, Henry V, Mary de Bohun, Henry VI, Richard Plantagenet Duke of York and Richard III.

The birthplace of the House of York. The site where the last Plantagenet rode by dead.
 
As a kid I had no interest in such things, it all passed me by, which is a great shame looking back.

It is more than 50 years ago now but the only church I would have visited would have been St Martins, school founders day and all that.

It is far too easy to be drawn into the more 'famous' sites than to appreciate what is right on your doorstep.
 
Some very deep stuff guys, but the question remains what are the benefits ( if any ) of mass immigration? I feel we have lost more than we have gained, certainly our identity and culture. Let in to many people from 3rd world countries and you become one, and we have.
 
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I suppose it depends on whether or not you consider British culture to be worth preserving.

Easy enough with some aspects of the British way of life but what about drunken yob culture, the splendour of the monarchy or it's innate corruption, the ruthless exploitation of the 'working' class during the industrial revolution and their destruction in the great wars of the 20th century.

Unlike some, I am, on balance, reasonably comfortable with our history. The excesses of colonialism, awful though it was in many aspects but also difficult to judge by the standards of today.

As an 'old bloke' I am aware that I am more in tune with the country as it was as I was growing up and somewhat apprehensive of what is to come, but what truly bothers me about these changes is that they are the result of deliberate policy of the British government/establishment most noticeably over the la 30 years.
 
AFCDorset said:
I suppose it depends on whether or not you consider British culture to be worth preserving.

Easy enough with some aspects of the British way of life but what about drunken yob culture, the splendour of the monarchy or it's innate corruption, the ruthless exploitation of the 'working' class during the industrial revolution and their destruction in the great wars of the 20th century.

Unlike some, I am, on balance, reasonably comfortable with our history. The excesses of colonialism, awful though it was in many aspects but also difficult to judge by the standards of today.

As an 'old bloke' I am aware that I am more in tune with the country as it was as I was growing up and somewhat apprehensive of what is to come, but what truly bothers me about these changes is that they are the result of deliberate policy of the British government/establishment most noticeably over the la 30 years.
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We’ve just adopted Americanism and called it our own. When did Halloween overtake bonfire night?
I remember watching Scooby Doo when they went out trick or treating and thought it would be great to give it a try to make a few quid. Eight of us went out, three got arrested for demanding money with menace and were let off with a police caution. (Ok, we took it literally and rose budded the houses of the tight bastards that didn’t give us anything.)
 
Richardvanles said:
We’ve just adopted Americanism and called it our own. When did Halloween overtake bonfire night?
I remember watching Scooby Doo when they went out trick or treating and thought it would be great to give it a try to make a few quid. Eight of us went out, three got arrested for demanding money with menace and were let off with a police caution. (Ok, we took it literally and rose budded the houses of the tight bastards that didn’t give us anything.)
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Once again, as an old bloke, I can remember when that was not the case even though my birthday is Halloween so I was aware of it from an early age.

Mrs AFC was born in Northern Ireland, they always did (and I believe) still do celebrate Halloween with fireworks rather than bonfire night.
 
Richardvanles said:
We’ve just adopted Americanism and called it our own. When did Halloween overtake bonfire night?
I remember watching Scooby Doo when they went out trick or treating and thought it would be great to give it a try to make a few quid. Eight of us went out, three got arrested for demanding money with menace and were let off with a police caution. (Ok, we took it literally and rose budded the houses of the tight bastards that didn’t give us anything.)
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You’ll be shouting at hamburgers & milkshakes next.
 
Running Fox said:
Somebody was telling me the other day that the boat immigrants are mostly UN troops who will be used against us, when we riot due to not being able to live with the price of basics ,fuel, food, heating costs, etc. It did make me wonder?:unsure:
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Did their blue helmets give them away?
I thought it was just the cold water!!
 
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