We think we’ve got problems

LGFOX

LGFOX

Roofer
Has anyone seen what’s going on at the mighty Barça. Their FFP is completely out of sync and the 5 players they’ve bought this season (3 for a total £135m including an ageing Lewandowski) plus two frees including Cristianson from Chelsea can’t be registered at the moment. They’ve got until Saturday. Also two more who are out of contract including Dembele who cost them over £100m but has scored just 19 goals in 5 years can’t be registered either.
They also still owe Leeds the first instalment on Raphinia. and if not paid will be fined £12m!
I personally love it. One of the original BCC’s who really think the rules are for others are in massive trouble. Apparently La Liga are ready to apply the rules though and all those players they’ve bought won’t hopefully be playing
 
The sooner FIFA / UEFA / the individual countries leagues start to really clamp down on financial fair play the better off we will be.

I’m totally convinced the big teams are doing something dodgy, what I have no idea but something is definitely amiss.
 
Sky saying that IF Chelsea get Fofana and Arnautovic it would bring their spending to over £300M +
This FFP thing is a joke imo.
 
Brauny said:
Sky saying that IF Chelsea get Fofana and Arnautovic it would bring their spending to over £300M +
This FFP thing is a joke imo.
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But over what period are they paying? Any Fofana deal will run into issues on payment terms - we will want +90% now, BCC do not like that for FFP reasons.
 
The big Spanish clubs are a joke financially it can only be brown envelopes keeping the powers that be off their backs , I'd like to know how everton can keep pulling money from nowhere and not be breaking any rules?
 
It seems La Liga have certainly let the big two get away with murder for years but ever since they both tried to breakaway last year they seem to have changed 180°. They even had to let Messi go.
When you look at some of Barca’s buys in the last few years they’ve been nothing short of a joke. £100’s of millions on basic rubbish with no forward planning.
They’re asking their players to take another wage cut this week to try and comply but nobody is interested apart from Piqué. The greed throughout the club is unbelievable from the president down
 
Nomadic Fox said:
But over what period are they paying? Any Fofana deal will run into issues on payment terms - we will want +90% now, BCC do not like that for FFP reasons.
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This might be the case with the new UEFA FFP Cost Control rules that come into place over the next few years (have no idea) but I believe is not the case for current Premier League FFP. When payments are made makes no difference. I guess clubs want to pay over longer terms for much the same reason that you or I don't want to pay for our homes in one go (you try finding £100m down the back of a sofa... for a player I mean, not the house!).

I think the situation (but note that I am not an accountant and especially not an accountant for a football club) is actually:

PL FFP is based on Profit and Loss. The cost of a player is capitalised as an intangible asset and amortised on a fixed line basis over the course of the contract (well, unless you are Derby who I think decided that a player kept their full value for the duration of the contract which is what the EFL challenged as it inflated the value of their assets and crucially removed losses for the years in question) so keeping fees out of it to keep it simple:

Player x is bought for £80m on a 5 year contract with payments agreed as 25% up front in Year 1, 25% Year 2, 50% Year 3. I think the impact is:

End of Year 1:

Balance Sheet:​
  • Asset: Intangible Assets increase by £64m (80m minus year 1 amortisation of 16m)
  • Asset: Cash/Bank decreases by £20m
  • Liability: Creditors owed within 1 year increases by £20m
  • Liability: Creditors owed after 1 year increases by £40m
  • Net Impact -£16m (i.e. loss appearing on the balance sheet against P/L)
Profit & Loss (used for FFP):​
  • Amortisation of intangible asset £16m
End of Year 2:
  • Asset: Intangible Assets decreases by £16m
  • Asset: Cash/Bank decreases by £20m
  • Liability: Creditors owed within 1 year increases by £20m
  • Liability: Creditors owed after 1 year decreases by £40m
  • Net Impact -£16m (i.e. loss)
Profit & Loss (used for FFP):​
  • Amortisation of intangible asset £16m
etc.

Obviously there is an additional P&L impact associated with paying Player X's salary.

Note that if the club then sell the player in Year 3 for £90m the P&L impact for that year is something like +£42m (transfer fee minus book value, so 90-(80-16-16)). Which obviously means net P&L over the 3 years of +£10m as you might expect for a player brought for £80m and sold for £90m.
 
Brauny said:
Probably my ignorance, but just seems a complete lack of clarity on what you can and can't do. It just appears to me that its designed to stop smaller clubs challenging the cartel.
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I think it is genuinely designed to try to stop clubs overstretching themselves and going to the wall (not that it has been a roaring success) but it absolutely favours the big clubs with large and established revenue streams.
 
And established is the key word. It was not introduced retrospectively so cementing the big boys in place.
It seems to me that the best way to sidestep the system is do what Newcastle (and Chelsea) have done.
Sell out to new owners who can come in and boost spending power to basically what they want.
 
Running Fox said:
I remember when a FIFA official commented we do not want another Leicester.
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Really? I don’t remember that at all.

Bearing in mind the whole world was behind us and what we achieved I’m amazed they don’t want more of it. We were the main talking point across the world and you don’t get that when Man City win it.
 
Oadlad said:
And established is the key word. It was not introduced retrospectively so cementing the big boys in place.
It seems to me that the best way to sidestep the system is do what Newcastle (and Chelsea) have done.
Sell out to new owners who can come in and boost spending power to basically what they want.
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They are both still constrained by P&S (FFP) so, yes, in theory the owners can invest in the club & spend money left, right and centre but anything impacting P&L (player amortisation, profits on player registration disposals [Sales], wages etc.) would (should!) still be within FFP rules.

As I think was mentioned on here the other day I'd say Newcastle have really yet to push the boat out. They have made noises about wanting to be sustainable and also in relation to FFP. No idea what their books look like for 2021/22 but were it not for COVID 19/20 & 20/21 would have both seen them making substantial profits (which obviously made them more attractive to buyers and made the fans livid with the lack of ambition being shown by Mr Ashley) so they have some considerable room to manoeuvre but ultimately they too will be looking to increase revenue for long term growth.

Chelsea are the interesting ones as their accounts are "up and down like the Assyrian Empire" (before taking into account COVID, 2020/21 was an eye-watering loss). They are helped though by having been bought by the previous owner before FFP was a thing so were "established".
 
Feckit said:
Is this when we nearly went ‘tits up’ in the early 00s or when we smashed the Premier League title… 😎
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it was around the draw for the European groups, after we won the title , because we do not generate the interest or the income of the big names. despite what people think its all about money not football or fans. That is why the big six wanted to break away and cut everybody else out.
 
Running Fox said:
it was around the draw for the European groups, after we won the title , because we do not generate the interest or the income of the big names. despite what people think its all about money not football or fans. That is why the big six wanted to break away and cut everybody else out.
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Not only a FIFA official thought nothing of us but Wenger too. Said we’d be an embarrassment to English football in the CL.
Well that didn’t happen Monsieur Wenger did it. Nor did your attempt to buy Vardy
 
I know things aren't too rosy in our garden but I think it befits this thread to point out Man Ure's problems as well:

Spent close to 700 million quid since 2017, including 80 million on Harry Maguire, appointed a much-coveted new manager once again, and where are they?

Rock-bottom! Two games, nil points. Home defeat against Brighton, then hammered away by Brentford 4-0 (who we coasted against until we threw it away ourselves). Lots of issues, including a messy transfer season with lots of rumours and much less fulfilment! Bad owners, too!

www.bbc.com

'A joke', 'bullied' & 'rotten' - are Man Utd at rock bottom?

After losing to Brighton last week, Manchester United were thumped 4-0 by Brentford on Saturday.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

I know it doesn't make things much (or any?) better at our end but things could be much worse.
 
So it looks like Barça have sold part of the family silver to be able to register the £200m load of players they’ve bought. What a joke. Totally in denial.
Great article this


www.bbc.co.uk

Are Barca gambling with future or just giving fans hope?

Barcelona president Joan Laporta's 'all or nothing' approach has led to fears for the club's future. Guillem Balague takes a closer look.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
 
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