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The snivelling cockney

Adumass

Bentleys Roofer
Yep sick of all these slags that drop their knickers for a can of cider or a joint or a jihad and then claim they’ve been groomed.

it is an interesting angle. if we (rightly) accept that girls who are groomed by muslim gangs are victims, then there is a strong argument that she is also a victim. is grooming children sexually a million miles away from grooming children ideologically?

tricky old world.

although i'm willng to bet the #savethechildren hashtag won't be lent to this case....
 

AFCDorset

Subscribed
Seems to me a British girl born , brought up ( and groomed ) here is our responsibility.
Should face justice here . We are better than this .
First question to ask is whether or not she personally committed any crimes, ie what should she face justice for. That is a serious question, as far as I am aware charges have not been considered.

Then there is the matter of where any such crimes were committed, I would assume that would be Syria, maybe we should let them handle this?

If she has not committed any crimes then there is no 'justice' to face so she would be free to go about her business in the UK. It all boils down to whether the government has the right to cancel her citizenship on security grounds or not.
 

AFCDorset

Subscribed
it is an interesting angle. if we (rightly) accept that girls who are groomed by muslim gangs are victims, then there is a strong argument that she is also a victim. is grooming children sexually a million miles away from grooming children ideologically?

tricky old world.

although i'm willng to bet the #savethechildren hashtag won't be lent to this case....
It is indeed.

Maybe we really should be looking into why we allow such things to happen in this country?
 

Foxgolfer

Bill Poster
First question to ask is whether or not she personally committed any crimes, ie what should she face justice for. That is a serious question, as far as I am aware charges have not been considered.

Then there is the matter of where any such crimes were committed, I would assume that would be Syria, maybe we should let them handle this?

If she has not committed any crimes then there is no 'justice' to face so she would be free to go about her business in the UK. It all boils down to whether the government has the right to cancel her citizenship on security grounds or not.
That’s the key principle for me . Does anyone have the right to cancel someone’s citizenship ? Slippery slope ?
Should that 13 year old kid running a neo Nazi terror group from his Grandparents cottage in Cornwall have his citizenship cancelled should a Home Secretary decide ?
 

AFCDorset

Subscribed
That’s the key principle for me . Does anyone have the right to cancel someone’s citizenship ? Slippery slope ?
Should that 13 year old kid running a neo Nazi terror group from his Grandparents cottage in Cornwall have his citizenship cancelled should a Home Secretary decide ?
A country can not 'cancel' someones citizenship, they can not deliberately make anyone stateless. In Begums case she has dual citizenship so that does not apply, she remains a Bangladeshi citizen.

So the government has the legal right to do what it did, it chose to do so for 'security reasons'. Hers and ours allegedly.

If you are asking as to whether the government has the moral right to do what it did, that is a different discussion.
 

Richardvanles

Bill Poster
it is an interesting angle. if we (rightly) accept that girls who are groomed by muslim gangs are victims, then there is a strong argument that she is also a victim. is grooming children sexually a million miles away from grooming children ideologically?

tricky old world.

although i'm willng to bet the #savethechildren hashtag won't be lent to this case....
Which is the very point I'm making.
Morals seem to go out the window for bloodlust to serve our own prejudices. We're all guilty of it whether we like it or not.
 

Foxgolfer

Bill Poster
A country can not 'cancel' someones citizenship, they can not deliberately make anyone stateless. In Begums case she has dual citizenship so that does not apply, she remains a Bangladeshi citizen.

So the government has the legal right to do what it did, it chose to do so for 'security reasons'. Hers and ours allegedly.

If you are asking as to whether the government has the moral right to do what it did, that is a different discussion.
That’s what I meant . She has never set foot on Bangladesh . Why should they have to sort it out ? We are supposed to be a leading world and moral power . It’s our mess . We should sort it .
 

AFCDorset

Subscribed
That’s what I meant . She has never set foot on Bangladesh . Why should they have to sort it out ? We are supposed to be a leading world and moral power . It’s our mess . We should sort it .
So you are argueing that it is our responsibility and should sort it out. Is that what you are saying?

Any suggestions for how we impose a moral argument on a jihadist sympathiser?
 

Filbo65

Thatched roofer
I think her human rights mean that she has the right to come back and kill herself (along with an unspecified number of others) in something her friends can help her plan and carry out
 

Harwichfox

Subscribed
15 when she went (groomed?) and apparently isis is growing again in those camps even murdering Kurd guards and just because governments don't want to deal with their own dirty laundry. If it was your child would you not want them home and take their punishment?
 

Harwichfox

Subscribed
Which is the very point I'm making.
Morals seem to go out the window for bloodlust to serve our own prejudices. We're all guilty of it whether we like it or not.
We and especially the yanks created Isis when we invaded Iraq so now we're trying to shirk responsibility by saying 'nothing to do with us' let them stay abroad.
 

HughJanus

Subscribed
You normally talk total shit but this time you’ve surpassed yourself. Radical Muslims have been around since religion was thought of, these nutters have just used that to satisfy their own need for power. The fact that we have people in our society that despise our way of life is very worrying and we should not import another one who one day might well want to murder innocent people
 

AFCDorset

Subscribed
The west have been fucking about in the Middle East since the breakup of the Ottoman Empire, about 100 years or so. The reason is simple enough, the entire world economy depends on the recycling of 'petro dollars' so the west, the US in particular, are determined to have some control.

But for countries like us, it is a nightmare, we have borrowed trillions of pounds, mostly from the oil rich gulf states, which gives them a huge say in our affairs, why else do you think that muslims in this country are virtually un-touchable?

Isis were set up and funded by the US deep state to destroy the Ba'athist state of Syria as Asad was not controllable by the west, but it has become just the latest in a series of sectarian wars that have blighted the area for centuries.
 

SteveYork

Subscribed
A country can not 'cancel' someones citizenship, they can not deliberately make anyone stateless. In Begums case she has dual citizenship so that does not apply, she remains a Bangladeshi citizen.

So the government has the legal right to do what it did, it chose to do so for 'security reasons'. Hers and ours allegedly.

If you are asking as to whether the government has the moral right to do what it did, that is a different discussion.
We already established that she is not a Bangladeshi citizen. The Home Secretary's position was that it was not illegal to revoke her UK citizenship because she was entitled to Bangladeshi citizenship and hence would not be rendered stateless. As I understand it that has not yet been tested in the courts. The recent decision was solely about whether Begum could return to the UK to participate in her appeal.
 

ClaphamFox

Subscribed
Works both ways, culturally she is a Bangladeshi muslim, part of the Ummah.

In that sense, nothing to do with us.
She was born and raised in Britain and has never set foot in Bangladesh. I think it has something to do with us.

If another country tried to force a terrorist on us - one who’d never set foot in the UK but happened to have British grandparents - there would be universal outrage. Nobody in the country would support that. Yet that’s exactly how we’re behaving.
 
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AFCDorset

Subscribed
She was born and raised in Britain and has never set foot in Bangladesh. I think it has something to do with us.

If another country tried to force a terrorist on us - one who’d never set foot in the UK but happened to have British grandparents - there would be universal outrage. Nobody in the country would support that. Yet that’s exactly how we’re behaving.
Whilst you are quite correct in what you say, that is only half the story. She is a muslim jihadist and a product of the muslim community, that this happened in the UK is unimportant, it's a cultural thing.
 

Filbo65

Thatched roofer
Can someone remind me – has Syria said they don't want her?
Or has she simply decided that she doesn't want to be in Syria any more, because her terrorist babies keep dying there or whatever reason, and wants to come back to the UK instead?
I guess it's the latter, otherwise it would be Syria arguing with us in court...
 

sixthswan

Mod Roofer
That's a good point.

You know. Turn your back on the UK and join an organisation that wants to destroy it. To actually goad our country into a war on Syrian territory, which they thought would lead to Armageddon and destruction of the West.

Doesn't work out. Now in a tent. Could come back to the UK and get housed for free, with a change of identity. So unfair...
 

Richardvanles

Bill Poster
That's a good point.

You know. Turn your back on the UK and join an organisation that wants to destroy it. To actually goad our country into a war on Syrian territory, which they thought would lead to Armageddon and destruction of the West.

Doesn't work out. Now in a tent. Could come back to the UK and get housed for free, with a change of identity. So unfair...
Yes, she goaded our country into a war. She’s to blame for the lot of it. Her and Jeremy Corbyn.
At least she dropped her knickers for a cause she believed in, not ten B&H and a can of Monster.
 
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